Ford Hybrid Sales Story

[Earthdog]

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-05-03/ford-to-pass-hybrid-sales-record-in-five-months-on-fusion-c-max.html

[jeff_h]

"and the top four markets for Fusion hybrids this year are Los Angeles, Washington, D.C., and San Francisco, Merkle said."

 

Four? 

 

Anyway.... I wonder if Ford's share would have been even greater than 18% if they had sufficient inventory of all models (such as Titianium Hybrid and SE/Titanium Energi Fusions and C-Max Energi) on lots?

[meyersnole]

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-05-03/ford-to-pass-hybrid-sales-record-in-five-months-on-fusion-c-max.html

 

Thanks for sharing that. I think it is yet another sign of this segment growing. It was not that long ago that the terms hybrid vehicle and prius were synonymous. Now all of the major vehicle producers, including the Porsche's of the world have one. Ford seems to be making a commitment here, but I would like to see it continue like Toyota which offers nearly all of its vehicles with a hybrid platform option (or plans to do so).   

[DelS]

Washington State and DC would be considered two different regions if you ask the folk from Tacoma. ;-)

[TX NRG]

Sales numbers for May: http://www.hybridcars.com/may-2013-dashboard/

 

Fusion Energi sold 416.

[TX NRG]

Sales numbers for June: http://green.autoblog.com/2013/07/03/june-2013-green-car-sales-jump-35-over-2012-numbers/

 

Fusion Energi sold 390 (including mine!). YTD 1,584.

 

Sales average just under 400/mo for Mar-Jun.

[Rhyalus]

This isn't very good.  BTW, here is a great site and single location for monthly sales figures:

 

http://insideevs.com/june-2013-plug-in-electric-vehicle-sales-report-card/

 

While I understand the high Volt sales with the price break, I do not get the continued success of the Leaf.  I would not be caught dead in that thing.

 

I think this shows that a) hybrid and electric cars are still not directly appealing to the "average" family consumer and b) that the price of the Fusion Energi is too high.

 

R

[Russael]

I still think a lot of people just don't have an interest in the technology, as well as a festering concern for the batteries.  There is a market for this stuff out there, but it's small.

 

 

 

Highlight the plug-in models and the numbers get even better, with Americans boosting sales of PHEVs and EVs by 83 percent to 30,655. Add in the Tesla, and plug-in sales through June may have exceeded the 40,000 mark, or more than 80 percent of 2012's full-year total.

 

But this is still promising... some people are coming around.  Even though there's millions on millions of cars on the road and this number is tiny in comparison - that tiny number is going up.  With gas being as expensive as it is, people want more fuel efficiency... or to get away from it completely.  I love telling people that I don't know what current gas prices are because I haven't been to the gas station in 6 weeks.  It plants little seeds that fester in people's minds when they're standing at the gas pump, watching dollars (sometimes over 100 dollars) go flying out of their pocket.  Then they investigate their lifestyle and see if they can make one work.  Then they walk in to the dealership, see the tiny trunks, and run away screaming... but a handful still go, "I can make this work."  And they add to the sales numbers. :)  It also doesn't hurt that the newer hybrid car offerings look gorgeous. :)

[Taylorjd]

I think there are still a number of issues. The higher price is one, if you don't do a lot of 20 mile or less trips and gas prices stay down, it will be hard to make the difference up. But if gas prices increase and the small amount of maintenance needed because of the low ICE use, that could change.

 

Also the charging station situation needs to change. They need a lot more, in more locations and a universal way to pay for them. We have a number of them around here, but they are all from different companies with different pay systems. The other thing they need is stations at offices. I have been trying to convince the Charge Station companies that it would be worth putting in Level 1 systems for office buildings, but they do not see a "business" model for that. I am at work for 7 to 9 hrs, a 110 level one system would be more then enough to make it back home and much more. My office is not willing to pay for the cost the stations and the cost of wiring in a 240V infrastructural for a few charging stations for a few people. But the 110v is already there, going to the light post and to landscaping. If they add a few Level 1 stations, they could require the use of cards that only the employees had. They could charge a monthly or yearly fee or give it as a business perk. I am sure the Fed tax write offs would make it more then worth their while.  What do you all think? Should I go on a campaign to swing them?

[Russael]

The only issue I see with adding 120V stations everywhere is each outlet would need to be a dedicated circuit, which means a whole 'nother panel with each breaker going to 1 outlet.  The cost of that infrastructure would be slightly less (cost of wire) than running 240 to charging stations, which would also need another service panel, one 240 breaker going to a charging station.  Nice thing about the 240 ones is most of them also have a 120v plug too, and a handful have dual 240's with a 120 (not sure of the electrical requirement for that.. I'd expect an 80 amp circuit at least).  Copper wire at 2 - 4 gauge is very expensive per foot.

 

Unfortunately, you really can't tie in to existing infrastructure, such as your lights or landscaping plug examples.  When those lights come on, they put quite a load on their dedicated circuit.  There probably wouldn't be much room left for anything else.

 

Now, that doesn't mean I don't want charging stations (120 or 240) at the office.  I very much would love to see that, ESPECIALLY once it gets cold... then I can remote start the car and have it pre-heat or cool while still jacked in to the grid.  Biggest problem with getting businesses on board with that is the initial expense, and then trying to justify it for the usage of 1 or 2 people.  That's what has held me back from asking for one.  One other person at the office where I work got a Volt 2 weeks before I took delivery of my Fusion.  So why should I ask for something that may cost the company 5,000 dollars to implement, but can only benefit 2 people?  I'm sure if more people jumped onboard (say of 4 to 6 people had plug-ins), then I'd have more ammo. :)

[Taylorjd]

Russael, I agree with everything you said, but not to sure on the dedicated circuit. I think it should be dedicated, but I have plugged my 110 in to a few outside outlets with no issues (I did not try to use the AC or Heat when doing so though).  Maybe it could be set to be on when landscaping or pole lights are off and off they are on. Seems like there should be a cheep but effect way to do it.  

[Russael]

Reason I say dedicated is because they don't make plug hardware beefy enough to run 2, 120V vehicle chargers off of 1 circuit (if you were using the included charging gear that came with your car, that is, and you only wanted them to install an outdoor rated plug).  If you wanted to have a 120V infrastructure for vehicle charging, each outlet would have to be dedicated.  If you plugged a leaf blower in to the same circuit and turned that on high, you'll definitely trip the breaker.  If they installed a 120V vehicle charging station that could run on a 30A 120V circuit, then you could plug 2 cars in at the same time... but I don't know if they have anything like that (never researched it).

 

The only time you may be able to share a circuit with a light load is if it were made to be 20A instead of 15... but then if you're making a 20A circuit, you're likely to use it to it's 80% rated capacity anyway.

 

If they had a rule where you COULD share a circuit, such as the lighting one, they'd have to figure out a way to enable the outlet once the lights shut off... and then that also depends on how the lights were wired.  If they have constant power and they all have dedicated photo electric cells, then you may be able to figure out a way to make it work... but if they only had 1 photo electric cell that controls an entire series of lights, well, then it wouldn't work because power would be cut to the whole circuit when the lights went off.

 

I've tried thinking of the least expensive way to have my office implement something like that and then to try to sell them on it... however, our director is very cheap as it is and was resistant to our building's remodel as it was (even though it was corporate ordered and didn't come out of the building budget itself).  And as I mentioned before, it's going to be a very difficult sell since it only benefits those who use plug in vehicles.  I DO think it'd be great PR though, having my company encourage the usage of green cars.

 

I think one other commercial business who could really make great use of a charging station is a friggin movie theater.  You're guaranteed to spend at least 1 1/2 hours there (unless you REALLY hated the movie and bailed early), and your car should be all charged up by the time you boogie.  Besides, they make a killing on the concessions. :)

[Taylorjd]

Russael, great explanation, a little discouraging, but well said. We need these stations to keep spreading and to become useful...so I will keep trying :)

[meyersnole]

This isn't very good.  BTW, here is a great site and single location for monthly sales figures:

 

http://insideevs.com/june-2013-plug-in-electric-vehicle-sales-report-card/

 

While I understand the high Volt sales with the price break, I do not get the continued success of the Leaf.  I would not be caught dead in that thing.

 

I think this shows that a) hybrid and electric cars are still not directly appealing to the "average" family consumer and b) that the price of the Fusion Energi is too high.

 

R

 

Rhyalus, I think the success of the Leaf is easy to explain... $199/mo lease and low $20s cost of the car in places like California where incentives are plentiful.

 

As far as the looks, that is part of it... it is the new Prius, but only better.

 

I like it, the more plug ins driving around the better the infrastructure will get for it. Maybe one day I will get a charger at work.

[TX NRG]

Sales numbers for July: http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1085932_plug-in-electric-car-sales-for-july-leaf-up-volt-down

 

Fusion Energi sold 407. YTD 1,991.

 

Sales average holding steady at about 400/mo.

[shaggy314]

I think one other commercial business who could really make great use of a charging station is a friggin movie theater.  You're guaranteed to spend at least 1 1/2 hours there (unless you REALLY hated the movie and bailed early), and your car should be all charged up by the time you boogie.  Besides, they make a killing on the concessions. :)

 

Or you can go the route I did... talk to the Management company (so few businesses actually own their buildings) and through them, the owner's of the building. The pitch, attractiveness of the building and setting it appart when they go to put it on the market for leasing... "Hey, we have a couple of charging stations" in a high tech city like mine, they went for it. Grnated at the time the city paid for most of it (and that is more likely why they did it), but they wrote off their expenses anyway. So yes, in a buidning complex of 4 - 4 story building, we have 1 pole and 2-3 people use it. I know when they go to advertise space, they mention it. Right now they are CharePoint and owned by the city with separate meters so the owner's are out almost nothing, even ongoing.

 

Talk to ChargePoint and Blink and see if they'd be interested.