Car won’t use electric mode

[Jasonwithana]

Hello everyone my name is Jason and this is my first car forum. I just purchased a 2018 fusion energi last Monday.

I live in Las Vegas. Everything I have read said the car is supposed to use all electric first and then the “hybrid” once electric is out of miles. This has been proven true for almost a week. I have a 220 v charger at home and a 110 at work. I get to work with 8 electric miles left and charge her up. On the way home I useally make with with 1-2 miles left. Home has a little more uphills. Monday through Sunday morning this is the way it has been. With the driving rating in the dash saying I used all electric to get to and from work. Used no gas. Yesterday after work I unplug and start car. To my surprise the engine is on. I go through all the settings and take it off auto and put it in EV mode and it says engine enabled. The whole drive home the engine was on yet still using my electric miles. That number went from 24 to 3 when I got home. Here’s the kicker. Shut the car off when I got home and it gives you the info sheet on how you drove. It says 20.9 miles and 0.00 EV miles yet it used almost all its charge... same today to and from work. Called ford out here. Two dealerships and they don’t know anything about the energi cars.. needing help if anyone has any info.

[Russael]

Putting bets that the temperatures there are so high that your car is disabling full EV driving due to high temperatures.  Weather.gov says 103 degrees in Vegas... that's crazy hot.  The car stops using the battery somewhere around 110F, and if your car is left in the sun, it can very easily reach that, or even at the end of a charge with ambient temps being that high.

 

I assume you're using A/C the whole time.  Make sure you have recirculate enabled; it'll stop drawing in outside air to cool and will instead just keep cycling the air inside the car until it cools off - this also allows the battery to draw in much cooler cabin air for the battery.

 

As aggravating as this sounds, this is likely normal operation.  I know people in AZ probably have this same concern.

[Jasonwithana]

Thank you so much for that input. And that answer makes me regret getting it. It’s hot here 4 months of the year. Which if that’s the case I wouldn’t have spent more for the “energi “ and just got the hybrid. I also want to point out one more thing for you. As of right now my car temp says 95 and is still only using gas Still doesn’t even shut the engine off at stop lights. And that concerns me just a little

[4cylinder]

Thank you so much for that input. And that answer makes me regret getting it. It’s hot here 4 months of the year. Which if that’s the case I wouldn’t have spent more for the “energi “ and just got the hybrid. I also want to point out one more thing for you. As of right now my car temp says 95 and is still only using gas Still doesn’t even shut the engine off at stop lights. And that concerns me just a little

 

Have you been driving the car previously for long periods of time without turning on the engine? If so, the car may be in "oil maintenance mode" (unfortunately 2017+ models don't have a visual indicator of that anymore) and that requires the car to be left on for about 30 minutes before the engine finally shuts off. The car needs to stay on continuously - you can't drive 20 minutes, turn it off, then drive 10 minutes. Kinda stupid.

 

My round trip commute barely fits within the EV range of the Energi, and I don't go out much, so I can go for over a month without the engine ever turning on, or only for brief moments (winter). If I keep that up long enough, eventually the car says "Engine on due to low use", but the message goes away on its own so it's easy to miss - that is indicative of oil maintenance mode though.

Edited June 5, 2018 at 02:46 PM by 4cylinder

[murphy]

There are two force engine on modes.

 

Fuel maintenance. 

 

If the tank hasn't been filled for 18 months the engine will run until the fuel level is down to 1/8 of a tank.  Putting new fuel into the tank will abort the burn.

 

Oil Maintenance

 

If the computer decides the oil needs to be heated up to get rid of moisture it will run the engine long enough to do that.

 

My car is over 5 years old and I have never seen either mode.  I typically go from late spring to early fall without the engine running at all.

[4cylinder]

There are two force engine on modes.

 

Fuel maintenance. 

 

If the tank hasn't been filled for 18 months the engine will run until the fuel level is down to 1/8 of a tank.  Putting new fuel into the tank will abort the burn.

 

Oil Maintenance

 

If the computer decides the oil needs to be heated up to get rid of moisture it will run the engine long enough to do that.

 

My car is over 5 years old and I have never seen either mode.  I typically go from late spring to early fall without the engine running at all.

 

Oil maintenance mode might only come on during low use in cold weather. I had it occur twice during Michigan's arctic blast, but for the entire spring and summer I haven't had it turn on. 

[muzicman61]

Thank you so much for that input. And that answer makes me regret getting it. It’s hot here 4 months of the year. Which if that’s the case I wouldn’t have spent more for the “energi “ and just got the hybrid. I also want to point out one more thing for you. As of right now my car temp says 95 and is still only using gas Still doesn’t even shut the engine off at stop lights. And that concerns me just a little

 

People in cold areas like myself have the same issue in winter months where if we are lucking we get 12EV miles per charge.  I still love my Energi.  Does the MyFord mobile app give you any extra information?

[Russael]

Oil Maintenance only hits me in the winter months, and I usually get it 2x a year.

 

Jasonwithana, how long is your commute?  While I doubt it is OMM, you could try driving around for about 30 - 40 minutes to see if the motor stops running.

 

On the off chance that the computer in the car is acting wonky... could always try a reboot!  And by that I mean removing the negative battery cable on your 12v in the trunk, leave it sit for a few minutes, and reconnect it.

 

Or, go to the dealer and have them look at it more closely.

 

And Murphy, if it is far too cold, that will also force an engine run, regardless what driving mode you're in.  I THINK this also may apply to temperatures that are far too hot.

 

From the 2018 manual conditions that force the motor on:

 

Engine On due to

 

Heater setting

The engine is on because of the heater setting. Reduce or turn off the heater setting to return to electric mode.

 

High Speed

The engine is on because the vehicle speed exceeds the level for electric mode operation. Reduce the speed to return to electric mode.

 

Drive Power

The engine is on when applying pressure to the accelerator pedal or switching on the speed control. Reduce pressure on the accelerator pedal or switch off the speed control to return to full electric mode

 

Neutral Gear

The engine is on because the vehicle is in neutral gear. Shift out of neutral gear to return to electric mode.

 

Low Gear

The engine is on because the vehicle is in low gear. Shift out of low gear to return to electric mode.

 

Battery Charging

The engine is on to charge the high-voltage battery. The vehicle returns to electric mode once the battery is charged.

 

Low use (Energi Only)

The engine is on to maintain engine oil quality. The vehicle returns to electric mode when low engine use mode is complete. See Hybrid Vehicle Operation (page 146).

 

Battery Temperature (Energi Only) (what I think is the problem)

The engine is on due to high or low high-voltage battery temperature. This is a normal operating condition. The vehicle returns to electric mode automatically when possible.

 

Normal Operation

The engine is on to optimize vehicle operation. The vehicle returns to electric mode when possible.

 

Engine Braking Actrive:

The engine is on to provide increased powertrain braking. This can occur when you turn on the grade assist feature, when speed control is on or when driving with your foot off the accelerator pedal. Turning off grade assist or speed control may allow the vehicle to return to electric mode.

Edited June 5, 2018 at 10:06 PM by Russael

[Davidoo]

I live in Phoenix and over the last few weeks I get some of the same behavior.  This is my 2nd summer with the car, and I just know that when it really heats up that will occur and it is just protecting the battery.  I don't have that occurrence on my 2017 near as much as the OP states though.  For me, temperatures have to be at least 105 degrees before the engine is enabled for performance.  I've never had my engine come on under 100 degrees, so I'm not sure why yours is coming on at 95.  The last couple of days has been 110 and almost 120 in my garage.  When it is that hot I don't even charge the battery as I don't think you are supposed to with those kinds of conditions.  

 

Jason, I know that limits some of the benefits of the vehicle during our hottest time of the year, but remember, we will be fully utilizing all the electric benefits all winter when most people can't.  I regularly get 29 to 33 miles on a charge during winter when the temps are in the 60s and 70s.  

[Jasonwithana]

Thank you everyone for your responses.

As far as gas and oil maintenance the car is only a week old So I don’t think it went into those modes yet. I think we’re going to have to chalk it up to the heat. Kinda sucks but you are right that hopefully fall winter and spring will make up for it

[murphy]

Are you keeping the cabin at a normal temperature (72 degrees F)?  Do you have anything on the package shelf behind the rear seats?  Cooling air for the HVB comes from an opening on the package shelf.

[Jasonwithana]

Negative. Nothing in the truck at all

As far as cooking the cabin. Idk the temp. I have it on recirculating and A\C. I never use “max a/c”have it on lvl 3

[Jasonwithana]

Anyone thought about this? Runs 8 hours and will pump cold air into the vents. Could this help in the vegas heat while charging at work ?

 

https://www.amazon.com/Arctic-Personal-Cooler-Portable-Conditioner/dp/B0787DD3RX/ref=mp_s_a_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1528430908&sr=8-3&pi=AC_SX236_SY340_QL65&keywords=portable+air+conditioner&dpPl=1&dpID=61REXWg0f0L&ref=plSrch

[jsamp]

Anyone thought about this? Runs 8 hours and will pump cold air into the vents. Could this help in the vegas heat while charging at work ?

 

https://www.amazon.com/Arctic-Personal-Cooler-Portable-Conditioner/dp/B0787DD3RX/ref=mp_s_a_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1528430908&sr=8-3&pi=AC_SX236_SY340_QL65&keywords=portable+air+conditioner&dpPl=1&dpID=61REXWg0f0L&ref=plSrch

 

No, that won't work.  It'll just make your car really humid.  Those just use a reservoir of water to make air "feel" cooler.  It won't actually reduce the temperature in the car.  Sorry.  Besides, when charging I believe the car uses the exterior vents for cooling the battery.  Otherwise charging even in moderate climates would cook things because the interior of the car is typically hotter than outside (during the day) due to solar loading.

[muzicman61]

I live in Phoenix and over the last few weeks I get some of the same behavior.  This is my 2nd summer with the car, and I just know that when it really heats up that will occur and it is just protecting the battery.  I don't have that occurrence on my 2017 near as much as the OP states though.  For me, temperatures have to be at least 105 degrees before the engine is enabled for performance.  I've never had my engine come on under 100 degrees, so I'm not sure why yours is coming on at 95.  The last couple of days has been 110 and almost 120 in my garage.  When it is that hot I don't even charge the battery as I don't think you are supposed to with those kinds of conditions.  

 

Jason, I know that limits some of the benefits of the vehicle during our hottest time of the year, but remember, we will be fully utilizing all the electric benefits all winter when most people can't.  I regularly get 29 to 33 miles on a charge during winter when the temps are in the 60s and 70s.  

 

Just found out yesterday my company is moving me to Phoenix.  Can't wait but will be interesting to see how my 2017 Titanium will perform in hot weather vs the cold weather of Central Illinois.  

[jasper7821]

I work in the middle of the desert outside of tucson and here at the airport it regularly gets 110 during summer. This is my first summer here with my 2015 Fusion Energi (owned since new) and last week I got home from my 33 me commute and the engine ran 100% of the time and also used the whole battery and my mpg was 46. I think it’s the heat, today on my way home I’m going to not turn on the AC for a minute or so and see if it will run on battery only. I charge on 110 at work and it sits for 3hrs or so fully charged until I leave for home so I’d think the battery is cooled down from charging.

Weird thing this morning on my drive to work is it was 80f and I would think I’d get 100% battery until it ran out BUt the motor came on 4 diffent times. And every time I was way below the blue line in the Empower display so the engine shouldn’t have come on. And I had no AC on and the windows down. I also changed the cabin air filter this past weekend and nothing is on the shelf in back. I don’t know why the motor came on.

I have an appointment at the dealer but I’ve talked to them a few times and they say there’s probably nothing wrong and it’s just the heat.

My car has 60k miles and out of warranty but I have an extended warranty but I have to pay $165 for the diagnostics.

My appointment isn’t for a a few more weeks and hopefully I can sort it out before then, to see if it’s normal in this heat or there’s something wrong.

[Russael]

I work in the middle of the desert outside of tucson and here at the airport it regularly gets 110 during summer. This is my first summer here with my 2015 Fusion Energi (owned since new) and last week I got home from my 33 me commute and the engine ran 100% of the time and also used the whole battery and my mpg was 46. I think it’s the heat, today on my way home I’m going to not turn on the AC for a minute or so and see if it will run on battery only. I charge on 110 at work and it sits for 3hrs or so fully charged until I leave for home so I’d think the battery is cooled down from charging.

Weird thing this morning on my drive to work is it was 80f and I would think I’d get 100% battery until it ran out BUt the motor came on 4 diffent times. And every time I was way below the blue line in the Empower display so the engine shouldn’t have come on. And I had no AC on and the windows down. I also changed the cabin air filter this past weekend and nothing is on the shelf in back. I don’t know why the motor came on.

I have an appointment at the dealer but I’ve talked to them a few times and they say there’s probably nothing wrong and it’s just the heat.

My car has 60k miles and out of warranty but I have an extended warranty but I have to pay $165 for the diagnostics.

My appointment isn’t for a a few more weeks and hopefully I can sort it out before then, to see if it’s normal in this heat or there’s something wrong.

 

If you had just finished charging your car before you departed (such as with value charge), your battery was likely quite warm still.

 

Very cold temps and very hot temps force the motor to run.  You can make those thresholds a little higher/lower if you run in EV Now, but the car will still circumvent it if it thinks it should.

 

I froze the first winter I had my car and still had the ICE come on even without heat from time to time.  If it did, it was an "aw, screw it" moment where I'd turn the heat on at that point.  It's been very hot here (low 90's - it's hot to me!) but I keep the car in a garage and I precondition it before going anywhere (remote start with it plugged in to 240 - the AC uses less power than the heater does so it can precondition without touching the battery at all) and my engine hasn't started in auto mode.  Yet.  I'm sure if it hits 100 here (and it has) and I drive, the motor will come on.  Or if I park it in direct sunlight even with it being Oxford White.  I got a white car on purpose to avoid excess radiant heat in the summer.  Wish Michigan wasn't so stupid with the tint laws... but it's still amazing the number of people who ignore it.

[jasper7821]

Thanks for the reply. I charged last night so the car sat all night charged in the garage. I did precondition the car this morning and but since the preconditioning on 220 doesn’t go through the battery I wouldn’t think that’s why the motor started up 4 times on my way to work. The first was about 10 minutes after I left for work.

I’m pretty sure when on 110 and you precondition it’s using the battery cause last week when I left work I preconditioned for 10 minutes (on 110v and 110 degrees outside) it ate up a bunch of EV miles when I got in the car to head home.

[Timewellspent]

Thanks for the reply. I charged last night so the car sat all night charged in the garage. I did precondition the car this morning and but since the preconditioning on 220 doesn’t go through the battery I wouldn’t think that’s why the motor started up 4 times on my way to work. The first was about 10 minutes after I left for work.

I’m pretty sure when on 110 and you precondition it’s using the battery cause last week when I left work I preconditioned for 10 minutes (on 110v and 110 degrees outside) it ate up a bunch of EV miles when I got in the car to head home.

 

Were you in Auto or EV Now?  If you use up all the charge and the car switches to Auto, when you charge and start your next trip it will still be in auto and could start the ICE like you describe. 

 

You are correct, trying to precondition on 115v is going to use EV miles.

[jasper7821]

Thanks, yes I did have it in auto but the motor still shouldn't have come on when I still had plenty of battery left. What would make the car start the engine if the temperature is only 80f outside and I kept the pedal way below the blue line in the Empower display. In the on-screen display it did say engine on due to temperature whenever the engine came on but I don't know why since it wasn't that how outside.

This morning it was sprinkling and 75f and the car ran great and the motor didn't come on for 20 miles and the kw used  said 4.5.

I made it almost to the freeway without stopping and only had to stop at two lights. I was getting 5.4 miles per kw at 50mph. Then when I got on the freeway I was getting 4 miles per kw with the cruise control set to 70mph.

So when it's cooler out my car does really great. I also had the AC off the whole time.

[Timewellspent]

 I did have it in auto but the motor still shouldn't have come on when I still had plenty of battery left.

 

It doesn't work that way in Auto.  If you want to run without the possibility of the ICE starting, you would need to be in EV Now.  When I first got my car I ran it in EV Now all the time even on the freeway and it probably wasn't the best thing to do.  I now hit EV Later when on the freeway and switch to EV now once I get back onto side streets.  I never use Auto.  My car only gets 4.6 kWh on a full charge now.  It was only 72 degree today so I just ran the car today in EV Now my whole trip just to see the results.  Here is what My Ford Mobile showed:

 

[breeves002]

Here in St. Louis its been nearly 100 degrees the past few days. I drive EV Now to work and use almost 100% of the plug in battery. Its a 22.5 mile drive. I plug into L2 there and sometimes will go get lunch sometimes I won't drive it until I go home around 6pm. Getting out of work requires me going up a very big hill which uses quite a bit of energy and generates a lot of battery heat. I notice the motor kicks on because of battery heat when its this hot out on my drive home. With FORScan I see that it kicks the motor on around 113ºF to 115ºF.

 

I'm honestly really annoyed at the HVB fan operation. Until the battery gets over around 110ºF it doesn't run at full speed when stopped. It will slow way down. I should be able to manually control it in FORScan but it didn't work correctly for me. I need to email them. I kind of want to make a PWM controller with thermistor on it so I can make that fan run at a higher speed even when its commanded lower in high ambient temps. It really annoys me that it doesn't run when the battery is fully charged but its still plugged in. On my Focus Electric it would run the ac and battery cooling (liquid cooled) as long as it was plugged in. Though It tried to keep that battery down around 90ºF at all times.

 

Keep in mind that even when its cooler out the battery will generate a TON of heat. Accelerating at max power pulls around 200A of current. 200A is a TON of energy! Like 60kW! That will generate a ton of heat. Pre conditioning the car will also heat up the battery more. The AC can pull more energy then the 220v charger can supply when its really trying to cool the car off. To put 200A into perspective, the 220v L2 3.3kW chargers will put only about 11A into the battery. Regen can put about 100A or so back into the battery too with braking. Which also generates a ton of heat. Not having a liquid cooled battery means it takes a lot longer to cool off. Fords low battery fan speed programming and keeping the fan off when its not charging but plugged in keeps it from cooling off as much.

Edited July 10, 2018 at 08:22 PM by breeves002

[jasper7821]

I'll try next trip using EV now and hopefully the engine will not come on. It's cooler out today from monsoons so I think it will run on electric on my way home until the battery is depleted. Here's what mine showed after my commute to work.