What's your next car?

[flyingcheesehead]

Well folks,

 

My Ford EV journey is over - Car went back to the dealer.

 

When I first picked up my Fusion Energi, I loved it right away. I picked up an Edge a couple months later, and I was hoping that when their leases expired, I'd be able to buy a Fusion Electric and an Edge Energi. The engineering on the Fusion Energi was fantastic, and I figured we'd be seeing a lot more EVs from Ford by now.

 

Well, not so much. Ford doesn't offer any more EVs now than they did way back in 2013, and the ones they do offer have had only the smallest of incremental improvements - Really no improvements to the EV drivetrains.

 

So, the Fusion Energi will go down in history as my "gateway drug," the car that showed me how awesome electric driving could be, from the manufacturer that didn't learn the lesson its own car taught.

 

I've been shopping for the next car for a while, and Ford's offerings (mainly the C-Max Energi and the Focus Electric) were way down the list - They're just not competing with the offerings from other OEMs. The Volt has always had better electric range than the Fusion Energi, and it's gotten significantly better. The Bolt is still a bit hard to get here in the midwest, but my brother has one and loves it. The Leaf can be had very cheap on the used market, but it's kinda ugly. I'm not a particular fan of the i3's looks, but my wife likes it. All of them have better cargo room than the Energi models. 

 

I managed to get a screaming deal on a BMW i3 (BEV, not REx) that'll replace the Fusion as my daily commuter, at least for the next year (lease takeover). When the Edge goes back at the end of January, it'll likely be replaced by a used Tesla, or possibly a Volt.

 

What did you or will you buy after the Fusion Energi? 

 

[jj2me]

Only had my FFE for 6 months, but (hopefully after 7 or 10 trouble-free years) I'll be looking first and foremost for something of substantial size and safety, like the FFE. I've yet to see anyone here mentioning those factors. No Bolt or the like for me. I need to balance out my probabilities against driving an old Alfa Romeo and a motorcycle.

[murphy]

I still have my 2013 Energi for trips to the grocery store, the doctor and dentist, and Lowe's which are all less than 20 miles round trip.  I put about 1 gallon of gas in it per year.  I also expected that Ford would have something better by 2017.

 

I have a 2016 Tesla model S90D for destinations farther than 10 miles away.

[jsamp]

Since I just got my Energi, replacing is several years away.  That's a good thing for Ford because it will give them a chance to get their hind ends in gear on a long range EV.  If I were to have to replace it today, there is no way it would be with a Ford product.  Maybe in a few years though.  So I chose "other BEV".

 

If I have to replace the wife's Escape Hybrid, it would likely be the upcoming Escape PHEV because she loves the SUVish experience.

Edited December 6, 2017 at 05:14 PM by jsamp

[openair]

After driving an F150 for almost 10 years my experiences with this vehicle for the past 3 years has killed ford for me.  Has also killed any gas vehicle built in the past 5 years or any PHEV.  They're so complicated to squeeze every last MPG they can get that when they no longer get that fuel economy or something intermittent occurs they have no idea where to even start.  My next vehicle will be a BEV of some sort.  Possibly a 60kw 2019 Leaf so i voted Leaf (twice, as its on the list twice ;)).

Edited December 4, 2017 at 11:30 PM by openair

[muzicman61]

i will probably only buy one more new car in my lifetime.  .That will be when i retire in about 6 years.  I'm hoping that technology keeps getting better and better and Ford will release a Energi version of the Escape.  

[jj2me]

Possibly a 60kw 2019 Leaf so i voted Leaf...

I'm curious why anyone knowledgeable like yourself would want a Leaf with its inadequate cooling. Worse than the Energi's, but with a higher C value.

[openair]

I'm curious why anyone knowledgeable like yourself would want a Leaf with its inadequate cooling. Worse than the Energi's, but with a higher C value.

The 60kw version is rumoured to have a thermal management system. 160km round trip commute means nothing short of 60kw will make the trip reliably in the winter. The bolt's seats are too narrow. The lack of instruments in front of the driver, long waiting list and no local stores push the model 3 down the list.

 

A local Nissan dealership will be holding onto a Leaf for test drives so I hope to drive my commute with the tester to see exactly how much the battery heats up and whether some self control will be adequate or if the rumoured thermal management system would be required. Also the leaf with all its buttons and instruments is a stark contrast to the model 3 that fits my personality better.

[jj2me]

So I was right, you are knowledgeable!

 

Seriously, thanks for that rundown. More info in that post than all the stories and tests I've read concerning the new Leaf.

[Russael]

I definitely want a BEV of some sort, but I also want one that has a charging infrastructure in place.  So far, only Tesla has that.  They're also the only domestic auto maker that offers AWD on their vehicles (a must in winter... but then again, I do have the 4wd Expedition, but it is on the table of selling it).  Every BEV/Hybrid domestically is FWD only, unless you want a used Hybrid Escape.  The other option is getting a 2WD BEV and keeping the truck around just for winter... which is kind of what I'm doing right now anyway.

 

Some beefs I have with Tesla is they won't support a person who fixes their own cars.  There's a guy on YouTube who bought several salvage Model S cars (flooded/wrecked, etc), and built a fully working one.  Total investment?  6500 bucks.  However, because he went the do it yourself route, he has zero support.  He can't get the Tesla app going, and when he called Tesla themselves, as soon as they looked up the VIN of his car, they instantly closed down and said, "Sorry, we can't help you.  Anything else?"  So it seems like even post warranty, you'll be stuck dealing solely with Tesla.  Be nice if they had a monthly warranty plan or something.

 

So... I'm voting Tesla.  Aside from that one gripe, I do like the company, their vision, etc.  And their warranty support is excellent.  It'll be a looooong time before I can afford one though.  I'd be inclined to keep the Fusion if an upgraded battery comes about in say, 10 years.

[meyersnole]

Not going to register a vote because I too am still happy with my 2013 and plan to keep driving it for quite some time. If I were to go looking today I would be disappointed that the car is not significantly different, while more refined, than the one I purchased way back in early 2013. I would be much more interested in a BEV than I was when I purchased this car both understanding how much range I really need and the availability of much bigger battery BEVs.

 

Given I did not put a deposit down on a model 3 that would be an unrealistic choice, but I would consider a used model S. 

 

I also like the functionality/range of the Bolt and it gets great reviews. The new Volt looks better than the first gen but I have not sat in one yet, I was simply uncomfortable in the original one and it had horrible sight lines. Maybe they fixed those complaints?

 

I have had 2 BMWs in the past and am a bit soured on the brand, not sure the i3 would change that and they are in a major recall right now anyway. 

 

Other cars that would be on my investigate list would be the VW eGolf and Chrysler Pacifica PHEV (Think I want a travel car next and while I don't like the look of the car it reviews well) or if it actually ever really gets here the Mitsubishi Outlander. 

[PJFW8]

I replaced my 2013 C-Max Energi with a 2016 Fusion Energi. These are great cars, They made me hate it when the gas engine came on. I have a first day reservation Tesla Model 3 coming to replace the Energi. There are no good other options that meet my needs.  I always buy Ford but Ford's EV is years away, at best. By the way, My Tesla ETA for rear wheel drive is January -March 2018. I am holding out for AWD which will delay me until fall.

[BLFarnsworth]

I loved my 2015 FFE and talked at least 3 to 4 friends into getting one.

 

But... all the love ended when I about the 50K mark. Nothing major, just a compilation of little things that has soured me on this FFE and the Ford brand in general. Here are a few things off the top of my head:

 

• All brake discs were warped (I'm very cognizant of how I try NOT to brake hard, to take advantage of regen) at 50 or 55K. New rotors all the way around.
• There's a vibration/buzzing sound in the center dash area that comes on when the ICE hits about 2000 RPM; no one at the dealership can find/fix the source of that sound - and it sounds horrible. You might expect this in an old Yugo, but this is supposed to be a decent car.
• I had a few temperature sensor issues where the check engine light would come on. Whatever sensor it was - it needed to be replaced two times. Good thing it was under warranty, but I was really hoping that it would keep going bad so I could apply the lemon law and get a full refund for the entire car.
• The 12V battery died at just under 3 years old. I understand that this might be typical, but there was no warning, other than I noticed that the entertainment center would display a "System is shutting down to conserve battery life" or something along those lines a couple of times in one week. Then, at the end of that week, I got a text saying that the 12V battery is low. 2 hours later the battery my wife was driving the car - the battery was so dead that she couldn't even get the doors to unlock. Instead of the car telling me that it's shutting down to conserve energy, why didn't it just say "Check battery" or something like that? 
• Yes, there's a key in the fob, but who the heck designed that fob??? The design is horrible, and when the battery died - my wife was driving it in a no-so-family-friendly town late at night. Try describing how to get the key out of the key fob to someone (my wife) in the middle of the night.
• The Ford SYNC system is terribly slow. You tap... and you wait.
• I also connect my phone via bluetooth; when I enter the car, sometimes it's still in Bluetooth Stereo mode. Sometimes it's in radio mode. Easy fix is to just leave it in the same mode as when you left the car. Nope. Seems to be random. Not a huge problem, but you have to tap... and wait (see above bullet point)
• The HV battery has probably degraded at least 20% after 60K miles. A familiar 7.6 mile trip that would leave 70% in the HV battery when new now leaves just over 50%. (It's a regular trip I take each morning, at the same time -- and I'm very aware of the outside temp, if the heater is on, how many people in the car, etc.). Maybe this is normal. Maybe this is caused by the number of cycles it's been through already... charging it (sometimes) 2 or 3 times per day.

 

I'm sure there are more issues I've forgotten. I'm just giving the car 1 more year (It's a purchase, not a lease) then I'll for sure get a different car/brand. 

 

Again, it was good for the first 50K (for me). Not so much any more.

Edited December 26, 2017 at 09:00 PM by BLFarnsworth

[expresspotato]

Won't be a ford all tell you what... Too many problems between this 2015 and the 2013 I had before it.

[bdginmo]

I have a 2015 FFE so I'm hoping I can drive it another 5 years or so. This should take me to 2023 model year or so. There should be a lot of great options available by then. My #1 complaint of the FFE is the lack of power. We just bought a 2017 Ford Explorer and wow that 3.5L EB engine has some power. What I want is a hybrid that has fuel economy and power. I want my cake and to eat it too. I'm hoping Ford will start experimenting with pairing these turbocharged engines with a hybrid powertrain. If nothing is available by 2023 that fits the bill I may switch to the Escape PHEV. We'll see.

[4cylinder]

I have a 2015 FFE so I'm hoping I can drive it another 5 years or so. This should take me to 2023 model year or so. There should be a lot of great options available by then. My #1 complaint of the FFE is the lack of power. We just bought a 2017 Ford Explorer and wow that 3.5L EB engine has some power. What I want is a hybrid that has fuel economy and power. I want my cake and to eat it too. I'm hoping Ford will start experimenting with pairing these turbocharged engines with a hybrid powertrain. If nothing is available by 2023 that fits the bill I may switch to the Escape PHEV. We'll see.

 

Lexus might interest you (their flagship car is an LS hybrid with over 400 hp!), though they lack plug-ins at the moment. BMW also has sporty plug-in variants of the 3, 5, and 7 series, and even the X5, but all have worse range than the Energi, and BMW reliability is also something to be wary of.

 

Btw, I have a 2015 Escape Titanium as my secondary car. I would be cautious about switching to the Escape from the Fusion, especially a loaded Fusion - the Escape is a downgrade in terms of interior quality. It's a Focus with a higher ride height and it shows.

 

I have no brand loyalty and anything is on the table as long as it has the bells and whistles I'm looking for and is reliable. I got a great deal on my Energi (thank the Gods of Depreciation) and will keep it for a while but if it turns out to be a lemon or gets written off in an accident within the next few years, I may switch to Honda (if they can improve the tech of the Clarity) or Lexus or even Tesla if they improve their Model 3 build quality. My parents have been Lexus fans for the last 16 years so I admit to having a little bias in favor of Lexus. If GM brings over the Buick Regal hybrid that's currently China-exclusive without compromising on tech, I'd also consider that (I actually seriously considered getting the 2018 Regal over the Energi at one point!)

Edited January 16, 2018 at 03:21 PM by 4cylinder

[Fat Fusion]

As long as it doesn't end up looking hideous, I'm planning on getting one of these Ford BEV SUV's in a couple years.

 

https://www.greencarreports.com/news/1114792_ford-300-mile-all-electric-suv-may-be-named-mach-1-due-2020

[Sandroad]

My wife and I are looking around a bit already after only a year of FFE ownership. We attended the Detroit Auto Show a couple months ago to look around at PEV and PHEV vehicles available. We were fairly disappointed that more manufacturers were not offering new ones that were affordable and/or didn't have an awkward avant-garde look to them. My overall favorites were the Audi A3 E-Tron and the Honda Clarity Plug-In, so we are going to track how Audi and Honda do with those. We are leery of Honda hybrids because we had massive, expensive failures in 2 previous versions of the Civic Hybrid. I hope Honda is now getting it right. For our FFE, when we bought it used last year, we simply didn't realize what a big deal it would be to have such a small trunk and low roof-line. Although we are in no hurry, we are likely to sell our Ford this year if the right alternative comes along. The writer a few posts ago that mentioned the FFE being a "gateway drug" for electric vehicles is similar to our situation. We are hooked! 

[muzicman61]

I'm anxious to see this newly announced "Baby Bronco".  Especially if there is an EV model.

[Multitask]

I only have the 13 FFH, but am looking at getting a new or slightly used FFHE.

What I see are (new) 17's for very close to the cost of 18's

But I'm not sure if there is an advantage to an 18 over a 17.  Especially if the cost difference is minimal.

 

as far as features, I know I don't want the SE, so a Platinum or Titanium would be what I'd get.

 

This is not going to happen till summer anyway, so I'm sure the deals will happen, especially if the 19's are coming and the 18's price comes way down to get rid of them.  8)

[4cylinder]

I only have the 13 FFH, but am looking at getting a new or slightly used FFHE.

What I see are (new) 17's for very close to the cost of 18's

But I'm not sure if there is an advantage to an 18 over a 17.  Especially if the cost difference is minimal.

 

as far as features, I know I don't want the SE, so a Platinum or Titanium would be what I'd get.

 

This is not going to happen till summer anyway, so I'm sure the deals will happen, especially if the 19's are coming and the 18's price comes way down to get rid of them.  8)

 

 

No equipment differences between the '18s and '17s afaik. Maybe some color options were added or removed at best.

 

The '19s make some driver assist tech standard on all models, but add nothing that isn't already available on the '17s and '18s. The Energi version gets a slightly denser battery pack that increases its range to 25 miles - but if you drive like a grandma and are very conservative about climate control usage, you can easily exceed that with even the '13-'16 Energis.

 

Go with a '17 and negotiate hard. If they don't budge and the '18 is just a few hundred more, take the '18 instead. 

 

The Platinum was discontinued for 2019 btw - grab a remaining '17 or '18 Platinum while you can!

Edited April 4, 2018 at 06:08 PM by 4cylinder

[muzicman61]

Is there any difference between a Platinum and a fully loaded Titanium?

[4cylinder]

Is there any difference between a Platinum and a fully loaded Titanium?

 

The dashboard has more leather on it, and the seats use Nappa leather which is of higher quality. The steering wheel position is also power adjustable. However the Nappa leather only comes in one color. When it comes to tech, the Platinum is identical to a loaded Titanium.

[Blastphemy]

 

What did you or will you buy after the Fusion Energi? 

 

Whatever I buy, it sure as heck won't be a Ford. Too many problems with my FFE and too little responsiveness from Ford. Not to mention 21 EV-almost miles is barely worth it when there are so many better choices out there.

 

I'm definitely interested in the Jaguar i-Pace coming later this year.

[Timewellspent]

Whatever I buy, it sure as heck won't be a Ford. Too many problems with my FFE and too little responsiveness from Ford. Not to mention 21 EV-almost miles is barely worth it when there are so many better choices out there.

 

I'm definitely interested in the Jaguar i-Pace coming later this year.

 

What better choices are out there that look like a car and not a roller skate and is at the price point of the Fusion Energi?