EV now and EV later

[Kaleido]

I find that when I use EV now and drive local roads and get down to about 5 or 7 miles left in EV mode and then switch to EV later because I'll be driving highway when I DO get off the highway and back on local roads, all my EV miles are gone and have been used up. I thought by locking into EV later it would save my EV now miles for when I want to use them. What am I missing here?

[murphy]

It is supposed to save 95% of whatever is left.  I have only used EV later when the battery is full so I have no experience with your conditions.

[Timewellspent]

Are you sure you are selecting EV Later and not Auto.  Auto will use it up.  I haven't had any problem switching to EV later with 3-4 miles left.  If you shut car off and start up, it will switch back to Auto which drives me nuts.

[Kaleido]

I will have to pay closer attention, I think I am selecting EV later, unless like you say it defaults to automatic and I miss that.

[Kaleido]

I will have to pay closer attention, I think I am selecting EV later, unless like you say it defaults to automatic and I miss that.

I guess that was the problem, it defaults to what I don't want. It seems OK now!

[Kaleido]

Some more information. I was paying attention today and used EV now on the back roads, then at 13 miles remaining, when I Got to the highway I switched to EV later.

I rode another 20 miles and it held at 13 miles left in EV now. Made my stop and when I started back home I made sure I was still in EV later mode. Then I watched as my EV later miles dropped to 12 miles, then 11 miles, then 10 miles and I'm still in EV later mode. After loosing these 3 miles it held there for the remainder of my return 20 mile trip. For the last of my trip I switched back to EV now and I drained it down to 1 mile remaining. I'm disappointed that EV later is NOT a hard lock on saving the EV now miles, they just kind of get eaten up without any control.

[murphy]

As I said in my previous post EV later saves 95% of the current battery SOC.  That's 95% every time the car is started in EV Later.

[Timewellspent]

Also, as I stated, it doesn't say in EV later if you shut the car off.  It will go to auto.  Next time you start back up, cycle through the settings to double check you are on EV later if that is what you want.  At least in my 2015 that is how it works.  I'm usually in EV now when I stop as those roads are when you want EV now, so when I start back up it will still be in EV now and when I get to the highway I put it back on EV later until I get off the highway again.

[Russael]

Another thing - that is just a range ESTIMATE based on your current travel habits.  For all I know, you may have been going a little downhill on the way to your destination and a little uphill the other way.  The car simply re-adjusted its range estimate.  My 2013 will do that.  I'll go in to EV later mode just before hitting the highway and I'll watch the numbers drop a little.  It'll re-estimate even if I turn climate on in EV Later.  But the actual charge level itself doesn't change.  

 

Since I'm traveling at highway speeds, (and now doing it for 2 trips - there and back), it thinks I'm going to be traveling like that more consistently.  The car has no idea if I'm going to work or if I'm going to my cousin's house with each trip.  It doesn't have any kind of fuzzy logic to go, "OK, it's Friday at 6:30, he's 90% likely going to his cousin's house, and I'll readjust the range estimate based on that particular route."  It'd be amazing if it did, but that's a huge mess of additional software just to make a number more accurate.

 

So if you're in EV Later, it'll tell you what % of the battery has been reserved.  You'll also find the estimate will fluctuate with temperature.  Once I finish a trip, the battery is usually pretty warm since it was just being used.  After several hours of sitting, it cools off and when I hop back in for my return trip, the estimate will be lower, sometimes by several miles.

 

The 2013's have that range estimate right on the battery indicator, but they did away with it for 2014 through 2016 models because (and I'm assuming) that Ford fielded so many complaints about that number because the masses did not understand how it works.

[Timewellspent]

The 2013's have that range estimate right on the battery indicator, but they did away with it for 2014 through 2016 models because (and I'm assuming) that Ford fielded so many complaints about that number because the masses did not understand how it works.

 

My 2015 has that range estimate on the battery indicator.

[openair]

My 2014 also has the range estimate on the battery icon. It was removed on certain later built 2015s and later year models.

[Russael]

Interesting... I thought it was removed on the 2014 late model years and newer.  I know some lost it after having calibration updates on their vehicles.

[jj2me]

As I said in my previous post EV later saves 95% of the current battery SOC. That's 95% every time the car is started in EV Later.

I see "0.0 kWh" displayed on my 50-mile EV-Later trips, which I presumed meant no extra HVB use. Because of those two "95%" posts, I monitored the State-of-Charge PID on my last EV-Later trip. Still got the "0.0 kWh" displayed, but SoC went from 32.8% down to 30.4%, about a 7% reduction, right in the ballpark of what Murphy said. Kinda surprised that the "0.0 kWh" doesn't reflect what's happening to the HVB's SoC. It seems plausible that the trip meter's displayed mpg is optimistic, because it's using that "free" extra 5% of SoC.

 

This then makes it hard, if not impossible, to calculate EV-Later mpg without depleting the battery to the MFM 0%, i.e., enough to be using the hybrid portion of the battery. And then use that for long enough to get to the 50% level of that hybrid portion, the level at which it wants to maintain its charge. But that's not a good overall HVB SoC (<15%) to be in for long periods.

 

Ha! I thought I was getting 43 mpg in "hybrid mode" using EV-Later displayed information. That's the hybrid mode/long-distance mpg I'm interested in, because I don't intend to deplete my battery and run extended miles in true hybrid mode.

[Kaleido]

So yesterday I started with a full charge and drove about 11 miles in EV now mode and switched to EV later for the rest of my ride because I was doing 60 mph.

I watched it drop from 13 EV  miles left to 12 EV miles left and then back up to 13 EV miles left, where it stayed for the remainder of my trip. 

I parked and spent the day. When I left I drove 1 mile out of the parking area before I remembered to check my EV miles left. There were only 7 EV miles left. 

I thought where the hell did they go? I rechecked if I was in EV later mode, and I was. Those 7 EV later miles stayed for the remainder of my trip back, but I 

can't imaging how the missing 6 EV miles got used up just parked all day. 

[murphy]

The number is an estimate.  There is no known way to measure the charge in a battery other than keeping track of what is put in and what is taken out..  There are a lot of variables such as temperature that affect the charge level.  Also every activation of EV later saves 95% of the current charge in the battery.

[rbort]

Sorry to jump in, but I need to explain some stuff to you guys due to misinformation.

 

#1, when you select EV later, you request a certain amount of battery to be saved.  There is no such thing as 95% of the current charge, its what it is when you save it.  The 95% is misunderstood.  What that means is that you are allowed to save a MAXIMUM of 95% of the HVB, so if you start out with a full charge and go to EV later, 95% of the battery will be save because the system needs some working room otherwise the engine would start when you go downhill during regen with L (not brakes).  Anyway let's not complicate things, just remember 95% is the max you can save, or any other amount below that, 70, 55% 10% etc.  The amount you save is the amount shown on the screen when you push EV later.

 

#2.  The car will operate in a range of the battery as in EV later its in hybrid mode.  So whatever % you save, expect that you can go down -7% from the save point and go up +3% as a max for either end.  In general you will run in the -5% to +2% of the set point.  So if you save 55% of the battery, you will see the battery charge level drop as much as 50%, and go up as much as to 57%.  It stays in this range.  Forget the miles on the battery, look at the % of the battery in the charge screen in MFT.  The miles are based on your MPGe performance, the better you drive, the more the miles for any given battery percentage.  In other words I can go 15 miles on 50% of battery, and maybe you can go only 10 miles on 50% battery.  Its in the way you drive, but its still 50% battery for both of us.

 

#3,  When you park the battery is hot.  If you let it cool down the charge in the battery can drop.  So you park it and come back several hours later it could change as much as 10%.  Say you had 40% battery when you parked, and then the car cooled off, its possible you power it up and it has 30% battery.  Your 10 miles range would drop from 10 to 7 if the battery goes from 40 to 30%.  The opposite can also happen, it can go up 10% if you park it cold and then it gets hot outside and the battery gets heated.  The charge level can go up.  Its measured based on the voltage of the pack and the higher the voltage the more the charge level indicated.  That's why you shouldn't leave your car in the sun if you can help it, especially if close to fully charged as the voltage can go up more than specs.

 

Hope this clears things up some.  If you watch the % level when you hit EV later you can see what is happening.  Also when you first start the engine use the Engage screen.  If you keep the speed up the battery is going to heavily assist the engine to go fast, so its charge level will drop several % points until the engine warms up enough and takes the load.  Initially its limited to 1500 rpms during warmup.  If you want to be efficient stay slow and let the engine warm up for a couple of miles (35-40mph) and then you can start going faster once it can take the load.  More efficient as you wouldn't discharge the battery trying to go fast right away and then force the engine to recharge it back up (read = lower MPG numbers while recharging).

 

Alot of know and learn about this car.

 

-=>Raja.

[muzicman61]

Great info Rbort! Thanks for sharing.

[jsamp]

So yesterday I started with a full charge and drove about 11 miles in EV now mode and switched to EV later for the rest of my ride because I was doing 60 mph.

I watched it drop from 13 EV  miles left to 12 EV miles left and then back up to 13 EV miles left, where it stayed for the remainder of my trip. 

I parked and spent the day. When I left I drove 1 mile out of the parking area before I remembered to check my EV miles left. There were only 7 EV miles left. 

I thought where the hell did they go? I rechecked if I was in EV later mode, and I was. Those 7 EV later miles stayed for the remainder of my trip back, but I 

can't imaging how the missing 6 EV miles got used up just parked all day. 

Kaleido,

The other thing that could be in play here is your use of heat/AC.  I've found the moment I turn on A/C the miles remaining can drop by as much as 3 miles.  If you had driven a mile and had the A/C on (plus the heat issue rbort talks about) you could have easily "lost" 5-6 miles.