FFE 2013 SE, New setting, battery keeps dying

[Chango99]

Hi all,

 

I got a 2013 SE back in March 2014 new from the dealer (was sitting for a while) in Southern California, where I was able to park the car in the garage and charge. I commuted an hour or so away to work so the plug in battery didn't keep me for very long...

 

I moved across the country to upstate NY and now the weather is bitter cold in the winter. I have been driving regularly very short stints as I live close to all of what I need. I live in an apt complex so I can't charge, and I park outside under a car port. My driving is <10 minutes driving 30-35MPH.

 

I was reluctant to drive my car for about a week when the snow came (stock tires) and when I finally went to try after maybe 5 days. Turns out my battery was dead. I had my GF jump me and rode around for 15 minutes or so to get it to charge. I'm not sure how the car even handles the charging 12v because of the plug in hybrid engine and how it turns off occasionally.

 

That was about a month ago. I went on a trip for Christmas for five days and came back fine. This past Friday, I drove again maybe 5 minutes to and from work, then tried to start it up today, Sunday. It unlocked and briefly blinked before I saw all the lights fade away. I couldn't start it in time before everything died. So it's dead again now until I can jump it tomorrow.

 

The things I have gathered:

 

• I don't ever use the plug-in portion HVB because I don't have a reliable area to charge it without risk of theft of my cable. If I was able to charge it, would the HVB and 12v be fine? HVB charges before the 12v, correct?
• My car is sitting in freezing temperatures 10-20F at the moment, which could affect the battery
• Telecommunications unit in my car draining battery? I unplugged my accessory dashcam because of the drain and don't know what else could be draining
• My drives are short, thus not giving my car enough time to charge the 12v
• My battery might be faulty?
• It's really annoying not being able to open my trunk and gather my things when my battery is dead

 

It's difficult finding answers because this is such a niche car model. I feel like auto places don't deal with plug in hybrids enough.

Edited January 9, 2017 at 12:32 AM by Chango99

[murphy]

Connect a small rope to the emergency trunk release handle and route it behind the fold down rear seats.  If the 12 volt battery is dead, fold down the rear seat and pull the rope to open the trunk.

 

If that is still the original 12 volt battery it is time for a new one, especially if it has been totally discharged.  That can damage a wet cell lead acid battery.

 

When the car is on, the 12 volt battery is charged by a DC to DC converter.  Your main HVB portion may be discharged but the 1.5 kWh hybrid portion is kept charged by the engine.  There is no traditional starter motor or alternator in the car.  The engine is started by the hybrid portion of the HVB.

 

Is there any public charging where you live?  Look on Plugshare.com.  A level 2 charging station can charge the HVB in 2 hours.

 

The 12 volt battery is charged, if needed, after the HVB is charged. 

 

There are lots of microprocessors in the car that are always on.  It takes about a week for my 12 volt battery to drop to 15% while sitting in my garage.

 

The freezing temperatures will not hurt the HVB but it can hurt the 12 volt battery.  Both have reduced efficiency when cold.  The main worry with the 12 volt battery is that if it becomes discharged the acid solution turns to water and can freeze solid which can destroy the battery literally splitting it open.

 

Was your telematics unit upgraded to a 3G version?  AT&T 2G service has been discontinued and if you still have the 2G unit it may be trying to call Ford with no possibility of success.  There is an FSA on your car to replace the unit for free.

[Chango99]

Connect a small rope to the emergency trunk release handle and route it behind the fold down rear seats.  If the 12 volt battery is dead, fold down the rear seat and pull the rope to open the trunk.

 

If that is still the original 12 volt battery it is time for a new one, especially if it has been totally discharged.  That can damage a wet cell lead acid battery.

 

When the car is on, the 12 volt battery is charged by a DC to DC converter.  Your main HVB portion may be discharged but the 1.5 kWh hybrid portion is kept charged by the engine.  There is no traditional starter motor or alternator in the car.  The engine is started by the hybrid portion of the HVB.

 

Is there any public charging where you live?  Look on Plugshare.com.  A level 2 charging station can charge the HVB in 2 hours.

 

The 12 volt battery is charged, if needed, after the HVB is charged. 

 

There are lots of microprocessors in the car that are always on.  It takes about a week for my 12 volt battery to drop to 15% while sitting in my garage.

 

The freezing temperatures will not hurt the HVB but it can hurt the 12 volt battery.  Both have reduced efficiency when cold.  The main worry with the 12 volt battery is that if it becomes discharged the acid solution turns to water and can freeze solid which can destroy the battery literally splitting it open.

 

Was your telematics unit upgraded to a 3G version?  AT&T 2G service has been discontinued and if you still have the 2G unit it may be trying to call Ford with no possibility of success.  There is an FSA on your car to replace the unit for free.

 

 

Yes the rope thing... it's honestly silly that we have to do this but oh well I guess?

 

I am going to jump my car and have to take it in somewhere today to check the battery.

 

On the 12v DC to DC converter charge, when is it determined that it needs to charged though after the HVB, Why would it charge the HVB first if the 12v is needed to start the car? How do I prevent it from dying?

 

Looking at plugshare, very limited few parking garages that charge for parking... no high power stations anywhere, so doesn't look like a viable option.

 

I have not taken my car in to replace it to the 3G, though I did receive that letter I just have not had the chance.

 

Thank you

[murphy]

On the 12v DC to DC converter charge, when is it determined that it needs to charged though after the HVB, Why would it charge the HVB first if the 12v is needed to start the car? How do I prevent it from dying?

 

Without the HVB the engine is not going to start - ever.  The high voltage turns one of the electric motors to turn the engine.  I forget which one is used.  The 12 volt battery runs the accessories and the all important contactors to connect the HVB to the car.  Even with a dead 12 volt battery the car can be jumped to get it started as long as there is a charge in the HVB, the 1.5 kWh hybrid portion.  If the car is not driven regularly, about 25 miles a day, then a 12 volt battery charger is needed to keep the 12 volt battery from discharging.  I connect my charger once a week to keep the 12 volt battery charged.  A little more often when the temperature hits the single digits, 8.2° F this morning.  Most modern cars that are computerized have this problem.  Tesla did it a different way.  They use the HVB to charge the 12 volt battery up to 5 times a day.  That reduces the charge level in the HVB.  It has a name - vampire drain.  There is no drain on the Energi HVB when the car is off because it is completely disconnected.  The 12 volt battery handles the drain.

[Chango99]

Without the HVB the engine is not going to start - ever.  The high voltage turns one of the electric motors to turn the engine.  I forget which one is used.  The 12 volt battery runs the accessories and the all important contactors to connect the HVB to the car.  Even with a dead 12 volt battery the car can be jumped to get it started as long as there is a charge in the HVB, the 1.5 kWh hybrid portion.  If the car is not driven regularly, about 25 miles a day, then a 12 volt battery charger is needed to keep the 12 volt battery from discharging.  I connect my charger once a week to keep the 12 volt battery charged.  A little more often when the temperature hits the single digits, 8.2° F this morning.  Most modern cars that are computerized have this problem.  Tesla did it a different way.  They use the HVB to charge the 12 volt battery up to 5 times a day.  That reduces the charge level in the HVB.  It has a name - vampire drain.  There is no drain on the Energi HVB when the car is off because it is completely disconnected.  The 12 volt battery handles the drain.

 

 

 When you say charger, you mean the 120v charger to charge the plug-in 7.6kWh battery, or a separate 12v charger for the under the hood? Would I be able to sufficiently charge my 12v if I'm able to get my 7.6kWh battery charged and leaving my car to drive engine only all the time, recharge once per week?

 

Thanks again, this information is very insightful.

Edited January 9, 2017 at 04:32 PM by Chango99

[murphy]

 When you say charger, you mean the 120v charger to charge the plug-in 7.6kWh battery, or a separate 12v charger for the under the hood? Would I be able to sufficiently charge my 12v if I'm able to get my 7.6kWh battery charged and leaving my car to drive engine only all the time, recharge once per week?

 

Thanks again, this information is very insightful.

I mean a standard 12 volt battery charger or a quality battery maintainer connected to the terminals under the hood.  Do not connect directly to the battery in the trunk,  That is an enclosed space and there could be hydrogen gas lingering in there.  There should not be any there since the battery is vented under the car but if the vent tube or the plug at the other end of the battery comes out all bets are off.

 

If you drive the car every day there is usually not a problem with the 12 volt battery.  If the car sits unused for a week there will be a problem with the 12 volt battery.  When the car is in operation the DC-DC converter charges the 12 volt battery just like an alternator in a standard car would.

[Chango99]

I mean a standard 12 volt battery charger or a quality battery maintainer connected to the terminals under the hood.  Do not connect directly to the battery in the trunk,  That is an enclosed space and there could be hydrogen gas lingering in there.  There should not be any there since the battery is vented under the car but if the vent tube or the plug at the other end of the battery comes out all bets are off.

 

If you drive the car every day there is usually not a problem with the 12 volt battery.  If the car sits unused for a week there will be a problem with the 12 volt battery.  When the car is in operation the DC-DC converter charges the 12 volt battery just like an alternator in a standard car would.

 

I did not mean at all that I would fiddle with the battery in the trunk. So I should invest in a 12v battery charger in my case. I drive my car about every other day, but again, it's usually short 5-10 minute trips.

[murphy]

I did not mean at all that I would fiddle with the battery in the trunk. So I should invest in a 12v battery charger in my case. I drive my car about every other day, but again, it's usually short 5-10 minute trips.

I don't know what the recommendation is for this car.  Back in the day it was generally felt that 25 miles of driving was required to replace the energy removed from the 12 volt battery by the starter motor.

 

Get one of these

 

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00962CQNC/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

and plug it into the forward power tap to monitor the 12 volt battery voltage.  If you see the voltage getting low when the car is off it's time to charge the battery.

 

I find that once a week is enough for my car.

 

All three power taps shut down about 70 minutes after the car is turned off.