AVERAGE Range on a Full Charge

[Griff]

This makes much more sense to me. I live about 10.5 miles from work, and when I drop my wife off when carpooling its actually over 11. So I try make the whole trip on EV. If I can use the engine and capture some of that energy spent through regen then I could see myself north of 26 (like I mentioned above my record is 40, but that was in the mountains). I was just wondering how some of you were getting 26 on just the battery. 

For the record, I am getting 26 miles on just the battery. I make it from my residence to 695 on battery only. The rest of the trip is in hybrid mode.

[meyersnole]

I am guessing you are not exceeding 60mph for long during that trip (that is what is killing my range). Today I drove 22 with 1 mile reported left today, was real nice out so no climate control.

[dlb92]

If you go an average of 35mph with climate on you can get about 30 miles.  I have done it several times even though I'm going 25mph below the speed limit :0.

 

I need a sign that says "I drive 45 to save gas"

Edited September 23, 2013 at 10:49 PM by dlb92

[joeblow231]

I was getting about 29-30 when it was warmer. Now that the mornings are getting cooler here it seems to have dropped to 27-28. My drive works out such that I can use Auto for the non-highway mile and EV-later for the highway and use up the entire range most days. If it seems like I'll have a little extra range left I'll switch to Auto for that last highway mile or so on the way home. I usually only use the climate system on the highway.

[jeff_h]

I need a sign that says "I drive 45 to save gas"

Gives new meaning to 'I can't drive 55'

[Brad Schuck]

Don't know if this helps but I average 1050 miles per tank. I drive 100 miles per day and have 17000 miles on my 2013 Energi in five months. The difference I see with the windows down is minimal versus using A/C. The drag, vibration and the noise with the windows down is not worth the hassle.

[meyersnole]

Don't know if this helps but I average 1050 miles per tank. I drive 100 miles per day and have 17000 miles on my 2013 Energi in five months. The difference I see with the windows down is minimal versus using A/C. The drag, vibration and the noise with the windows down is not worth the hassle.

 

I think whatever you want to do here, this car performs wonderfully compared to a car of equivalent size and comfort. I am extremely impressed with how little fuel I am burning for a car this size. I went over 2500 miles before my first fill up!

 

I am pretty sure you will be using more energy running the AC then running with the windows down (due to increased drag), but you still are using considerably less the this car with a straight gas engine propulsion system. If you want to run the A/C, run it! I do. You still wont be going to the gas station that often. 

[dlb92]

The AC does not use that much energy..if you precondition and keep it at 72 you are looking at 500 to 600 watts (half of the first bar).  It barely affects the mileage--you might lose 2 miles..

[meyersnole]

The AC does not use that much energy..if you precondition and keep it at 72 you are looking at 500 to 600 watts (half of the first bar).  It barely affects the mileage--you might lose 2 miles..

 

I think that is a pretty close guess. Unfortunately I need those 2 miles to make it all the way home. :shift:

[ChuckJ]

Don't forget you've got another 1-2 miles on the hybrid portion of the battery after are reading 0 miles.

 

ChuckJ

[shaggy314]

Also, since I now drive like a well-seasoned octogenarian, my fuel gauge now shows 700+ miles when I fill up my gas tank.

 

I only have two fuel ups and I think the first was 680ish and the last one was 720+. I, so far, have filled up at 2315 and 5075 miles. Tracking third tank to be in December around 7500ish. :victory:

[Fat Fusion]

I made it the 25 miles back from work today after plugging in at a BLINK charger on site.  My car finally went into EV+ mode !   :headspin:

 

Why did it say 24 miles of expected range after charging it today?  Was it because it was a L2 charger, or because it was during the day and warm outside?  Usually in the mornings after plugging in on 110 it shows 21 miles.

[murphy]

It's because of the L2 charger.

[Elsny]

What happens when it goes to 0? Does it automatically switch modes on its own? I've only had the car a few days and was afraid to let it get too low.

[Elsny]

With the L2 charger are those extra miles "real" or display only?

[murphy]

What happens when it goes to 0? Does it automatically switch modes on its own? I've only had the car a few days and was afraid to let it get too low.

Yes, the HVB display with the miles estimate goes away and is replaced with the battery display that shows the current SOC of the hybrid battery.

 

There is no problem with letting it get to zero other than the car will be in hybrid mode and the engine will come into play.

There is only one battery.  The hybrid battery is just a reserved portion of the whole battery.  The car will not let the hybrid battery go below about 25% SOC.  The engine will come on to recharge it.

[murphy]

With the L2 charger are those extra miles "real" or display only?

They are real.  The L2 charger is considerably more efficient than the L1 charger.

[Fat Fusion]

They are real.  The L2 charger is considerably more efficient than the L1 charger.

Wouldn't the efficiency affect charging time and energy consumption and not peak charge level?

 

As a data point, after charging overnight on 110 it initially said 23 miles this morning. I'm guessing it's based on recent range for a full charge.

[wxdude]

I get from 18 to 20 miles on the HVB, depending on the traffic.  Almost all of my commute is on the interstate at 70 mph.  In heavy traffic I find I get upwards of 20 miles and on an empty interstate I get right around 18 miles.  Drafting difference maybe?  Both are done at 70 mph.

[howardbc]

Murphy, so you mean that a full charge done by an L2 charger provides more EV miles than a full-charge with a standard 120v wall outlet?? If I understand you correctly, I didn't realize that. I knew of course that the L2 charger is faster, but didn't realize that it puts more EV miles into the battery. Let me know if I am misunderstanding. Thanks. 

[wxdude]

Murphy, so you mean that a full charge done by an L2 charger provides more EV miles than a full-charge with a standard 120v wall outlet?? If I understand you correctly, I didn't realize that. I knew of course that the L2 charger is faster, but didn't realize that it puts more EV miles into the battery. Let me know if I am misunderstanding. Thanks. 

 

I don't see how charge rate would effect the final charge state of a battery.  I work with LiPo batteries in RC helicopters and the only thing that increasing the charge rate does is cut down the charge time.  Once the battery is charged, it is fully charged no matter what rate it was charged at.

 

I hope Murphy isn't trying to say you get more out of your battery with a L2 charger.  It is more efficient charging the HVB, using less KW from your wall outlet...but at the end of the charge the battery is at the same state as a 110 charge.

[murphy]

I have always charged my battery with an L2 charger.  A week ago my driveway was repaved and I couldn't put the car into the garage.  I charged the battery using the L1 charger and got 3 miles fewer than normal.  Possibly the L1 charger is incapable of generating a high enough voltage to completely charge the battery to the same level that an L2 charger does.

 

240 volts times the square root of 2 is 339 volts.  The battery is believed to be between 275 and 300 volts.

 

120 volts times the square root of 2 is 170 volts. 

That's way less than the battery voltage so who knows what method they are using to get the extra voltage needed to charge the battery.

 

I may be able to determine how it works in a week or two.  I was finally able to order the wiring diagrams for the car.

[larryh]

I use both Level 1 and Level 2 chargers all the time.  I get the same EV range using either one.  However, the L2 charger takes about 0.9 kWh less energy to fully charge a depleted battery, and hence, is more efficient in charging the battery.

Edited October 16, 2013 at 09:04 PM by larryh

[wxdude]

I have always charged my battery with an L2 charger.  A week ago my driveway was repaved and I couldn't put the car into the garage.  I charged the battery using the L1 charger and got 3 miles fewer than normal.  Possibly the L1 charger is incapable of generating a high enough voltage to completely charge the battery to the same level that an L2 charger does.

 

240 volts times the square root of 2 is 339 volts.  The battery is believed to be between 275 and 300 volts.

 

120 volts times the square root of 2 is 170 volts. 

That's way less than the battery voltage so who knows what method they are using to get the extra voltage needed to charge the battery.

 

I may be able to determine how it works in a week or two.  I was finally able to order the wiring diagrams for the car.

 

Where is the square root of 2 coming in from?

 

I do not know the specifics of the charger on our vehicles; however I will say that they are designed to fully utilize the input voltage.  If the manufacturer said it is designed for a 110 or L2 charger, it will be engineered to fully utilize both systems. 

 

Here is some simple Ohm's Law. (Keeping it simple, not accounting for efficiency loss and so forth.) Amps times Volts equals Watts.

 

Input 120V 11 Amps

 

That is right around 1300 Watts pulling from the AC outlet.  If the charger was 100% efficient that would give a little over 4 amps charge rate for a 300 volt battery.

 

Input 220V 11 Amps

That is around 2600 Watts pulling from the AC outlet.  That would give over an 8 amp charge rate on a 300 volt battery. (I do not know the amp draw for L2 chargers so I am putting a number in here)

 

The important thing to note is that as the voltage changes the only change is the wattage going into the battery.  As I said before the engineers have designed this vehicle for multiple charge sources and have taken all of this into account.  They would not design a vehicle that would not fully charge on a standard 110 plug, esp when they include a 110 charger with the car.

 

Hope this makes sense.

Edited October 16, 2013 at 09:10 PM by wxdude

[murphy]

Where is the square root of 2 coming in from?

RMS (root mean square) sine voltage (the standard 120 volts or 240 volts from your wall)  times the square root of 2 equals the peak voltage.  Bridge rectify the AC voltage and feed it to a large capacitor and you get a DC voltage very close to the peak voltage.  That is the maximum DC voltage available without special circuitry or a heavy iron core transformer with large gauge wire to handle the current.