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larryh

Fusion Energi Member
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Everything posted by larryh

  1. I updated my post showing the efficiency of the motor/generator with better data at: http://www.fordfusionenergiforum.com/topic/1880-obd-ii-data-for-ice/?p=13034 During normal operation in EV mode, the generator is generating electricity and the motor is consuming it. The amount of electricity consumed by the generator is a function of generator rpms. The faster the generator spins, the more torque it consumes to generate electricity up to 6000 rpm and then it levels off. From the Motor/Generator map, you can see that efficiency increases significantly with increasing torque. I assume the engineers are trying to increase the torque on the electric motor to force it to operate more efficiently. I would have expected them to both work together to power the car rather than opposing each other. During regenerative braking, they both work together to generate electricity.
  2. larryh

    Motor/Generator Map

    From the album: Car

    Motor/Generator map showing efficiency of the electric motor/generator for a given RPM/Torque operating point. 8400 rpm corresponds to about 60 mph.
  3. The charge port ring should not be flashing more than a minute or two after turning off the car. If it continues to flash, something is not shutting down properly for some reason. It flashes when it is charging.
  4. If never experience any accidental unplug messages. It just gets impatient if I don't plug it in. I have lots of GO times set, so it keeps complaining it can't charge the car prior to my GO times.
  5. I get those messages all the time: Scheduled Charge did not begin - external fault. I simply ignore them. The car is complaining because I did not plug it in or I had the charger turned off. Sometimes it displays the following instead: Your vehicle is scheduled to begin charging soon and needs to be plugged in. It is very persistent if I don't plug it in or turn the charger on. I had over 100 messages waiting in the queue. If you have scheduled GO times and don't plug the car in soon enough before the GO times, it will complain.
  6. I am referring to the power flow display on MFT accessed by selecting the EV Info button and then the power tab. The Status indicates either “Hybrid Drive” or “Charging HV Battery” when the ICE is on while driving. When it indicates “Hybrid Drive”, then either the generator or the motor is generating electricity while the other is consuming it. Usually, the motor is consuming combined power from the ICE and generator to generate electricity, while the generator is consuming electricity to assist the ICE in providing power to the wheels and the motor (acting as a generator). In this configuration, the motor may generate more electricity than the generator consumes. The surplus electric power is used to charge the HVB. Alternatively, the generator may use more electricity than the motor generates. The electricity power deficit is supplied by the HVB. Usually the surplus or deficit in electricity is only a few kW. I have not observed both the generator and motor acting together, along with the ICE, to provide power to the wheels. I have only observed the generator and motor to act together to generate electricity during regenerative braking. When the car decides to aggressively charge the HVB, the status changes to “Charging HV Battery”. Now both the motor and the generator are consuming power from the ICE to charge the HVB. They may produce 10 kW or more of electric power. Determining whether less gas will be consumed by constantly running the ICE in “Hybrid Drive”, or by repeatedly running the ICE in “Charging HV Battery” mode and then turning off the ICE while allowing EV operation to consume the energy generated while in “Charging HV Battery” mode is a very complex task. Hopefully, the car has been programmed to do the right thing.
  7. Sorry, but my math is incorrect here. The "Hybrid Drive" mode is more efficient than the "Charging HV Battery Mode". The correct computation is as follows: In the "Hybrid Drive" mode, rather than going 1 minute using 0.0276 gallons of gas, you can can now go 1.14 minutes (14% longer) on the same amount of gas. After you have gone for one minute, you now have stored enough energy in the HVB to go another 14%*1 minutes = 0.14 minutes in EV mode. Similarly, in "Charging HV Battery" mode, rather than going 1 minute using 0.414 gallons of gas, you can now go 1.57 minutes (57% longer) on the same amount of gas. So, the effective gas consumption rate is: "Hybrid Drive" 0.0276/1.14 = 0.0242 gallons/min "Charging HV Battery" 0.0414/1.57 = 0.0264 gallons/min "Hybrid Drive" is more efficient. If I look at the instantaneous gas mileage in "Hybrid Drive" going 66 mph, I see 38.8 MPG. But it is also generating power that is stored in the HVB that can be used to later power the car in EV mode. Taking that into account, the effective MPGe is actually 44.4 MPGe. Similarly, if I look at the instantaneous gas mileage in "Charging HV Battery" mode going 66 mph, I see 26.7 MPG. The effective MPGe is actually 41.7 MPGe. The instantaneous MPG displayed on the car's console can be deceiving. The ICE may be generating power being stored in the HVB which can be used later in EV mode. You may see 26.7 MPG, but you are really effectively getting 41.7 MPGe.
  8. I looked at today's data to see what was happening in "Hybrid Drive" vs "Charging HV Battery". This is traveling at 66 mph on the freeway. I observed the following data in each of the modes: "Hybrid Drive" Avg. Fuel flow: 0.0276 gal/min Power to HVB: 2.56 kW ICE output power: 19.9 kW Power to Wheels: 16.1 kW "Charging HV Battery" Avg. Fuel flow: 0.0414 gal/min Power to HVB: 10.55 kW ICE output power: 28.0 kW Power to Wheels: 18.1 kW Apparently, the freeway is not level. It required more power to the wheels in the "Charging HV Battery" segment. It requires about 16.7 kW of power in EV mode to travel this same speed. Assuming 90% of the energy stored in the battery can be retrieved, that means for the different modes, that the ICE generated enough power to power the car in EV mode the following percent of the time: "Hybrid Drive" 0.9*2.56/16.7 = 14% "Charging HV Battery" 0.9*10.55/16.7 = 57% So the ICE could be off 14% of the time in "Hybrid Drive" mode vs. 57% of the time in "Charging HV Battery" mode. So the effective fuel consumption in each mode is: "Hybrid Drive" (1-0.14)*.0276 = 0.024 gal/min "Charging HV Battery" (1-0.57)*.0414 = 0.018 gal/min The "Charging HV Battery" mode uses 75% of the fuel of the "Hybrid Drive" mode. This simplistic analysis suggests that you want the ICE to charge the HVB and then when it is full, discharge the HVB with the ICE off. The Hybrid Drive mode may, in fact, be less efficient.
  9. Today, I left the mode set to EV auto for my entire 60 mile highway/freeway (55-65 mph) commute home, rather than reserving the HVB for the slower segments of my route. It was 39 F. I got 23 EV miles before the battery depleted (That's about the best range I got last summer. I haven't seen any degradation in range of the HVB after one year). The remaining miles were then in hybrid mode. I achieved 68 MPGe. The previous high MPGe at that temperature was 60 MPGe. One data point is certainly not conclusive. I will have to investigate further the efficiency of EV Later mode vs. Hybrid mode.
  10. The following are the relationships between the rotations of the motor, generator, ICE, and wheels: (motor rpm + generator rpm) ------------------------------------ = ICE rpm 3.55 10.39 * wheel rpm = motor rpm Usually, the motor rpm and generator rpm have opposite signs. So in order to prevent the ICE from spinning (EV mode), the motor and generator must have equal, but opposite RPMs.
  11. The generator has several modes of operation, including modes called Torque, Speed, various types of Engine Start, and Engine Stop. In the Torque mode, the generator and motor rotate at the same speed. In the other modes, their rotation speeds differ. The Torque mode is used during EV operation. The Speed mode is used when the ICE is on. The definition of the torque output by the generator (positive or negative torque) seems to depend on the generator mode.
  12. If I assume 90% efficiency for the generator and motor, then we have: The motor converting 7.4 kW of mechanical energy to 6.7 kW of electrical energy. The generator producing 5.4 kW of mechanical energy by consuming 6 kW of electrical energy. There is a 0.7 kW net surplus of electrical energy which closely matches the 0.6 kW of electrical energy being supplied to the HVB. So both the mechanical and electrical power produced/consumed by the ICE, motor, generator, and HVB all balance out.
  13. I have an Intermatic T104 mechanical timer for my 240 volt charger that is rated for 40 amps. I don't have a timer for the 120 volt charger. I have not had any power outages since I installed it. It is simpler to set the time and the start/stop times on a mechanical timer than on a digital timer. It does not have to be precise--it does not matter whether it charges at 12:10 am or 12:20 am. The only annoyance is overriding the start/stop times when the triggers are in the process of turning the timer on or off. It would also have been nice to have a 7 week timer rather than a 24 hour timer, so I don't need to override the start/stop times on the weekend.
  14. The Electric Heater heats the coolant in the heater core loop to about 140 F. It appears that the valve between the main engine loop and the heater core loop opens when the engine coolant temperature reaches 140 F. The engine coolant pump is on whenever the ICE is on. When the engine coolant temperature is below 140 F, the engine coolant pump turns off when the ICE turns off. When the engine coolant temperature is 140 F and above, it remains on, even when the ICE is off, as long as the heater is on. Turning climate on and off, turns the engine coolant pump on and off when the engine coolant temperature is 140 F and above.
  15. I attempted to measure the efficiency of regenerative braking. I started at 54 mph, placed the drive in Low, and removed my foot from the accelerator. The total mechanical energy generated by the motor/generator was 0.115 kWh. The total electric energy supplied to the HVB (accounting for power required to run the accessories) was 0.110 kWh. If these numbers are correct, the efficiency was about 96%. The motor/generator started out generating about 30 kW of electrical power, which gradually decreased when speed fell below 50 mph. The efficiency seemed greatest around 20 to 40 mph. Below 20 mph, efficiency dropped off rapidly. I am revising my estimate for regenerative braking to range from 80% to 95%. The car's speed dropped from about 54 mph to 8 mph. I estimate the total change in kinematic energy to be about 0.143 kWh. So the motor/generator only received 0.115 / 0.143 = 80% of the kinetic energy. The remaining energy must have been lost due to aerodynamic drag, rolling resistance of tires, and friction.
  16. This is what I observe in Electric Drive going with cruise control set to 55 mph on a relatively level road (GPS speed was 54.3 mph): Mechanical Power Consumed Average power applied to wheels: 14.3 kW. Mechanical Power Generated Average power output from motor: 11.6 kW Average power output from generator: -1.8 kW Total: 9.8 kW Electrical Power Consumed Average power consumed by accessories: 0.6 kW Average power consumed by motor and generator: 14.6 kW Total: 15.1 kW The generator seems to be generating electricity rather than propelling the car along with the motor. The motor is consuming electricity to generate mechanical power and the generator is consuming some of that mechanical power to convert it back to electricity. The power provided by the motor and generator to power the wheels is 11.6 - 1.8 = 9.8 kW. The efficiency of the motor/generator seems to be: 9.8 / 14.6 = 67%. Note that the car reports the wheels are being supplied with 14.3 kW of power. There a big gap in power produced by the motor/generator of 9.8 kW to power the wheels and what the car reports for power at the wheels of 14.3 kW. The reported value of 14.3 kW cannot be right. If I plot the reported power at the wheels and the HVB power, they are equal. It is impossible to convert 100% of the electrical power from the HVB to mechanical power and transmit all that power to the wheels. In a normal car, the loss in power in the transmission alone is between 15% and 20%. In addition, a motor/generator is not 100% efficient. The other power measurements seem to be correct. Note that I would expect the motor/generator to use less power to power the wheels than the ICE. The ICE needs to use the transmission to power the wheels. I think the electric motor has a more direct route to the wheels which will be more efficient in transmitting power to the wheels. .
  17. I meant 75% recapture efficiency to imply the amount of kinematic energy restored through regenerative braking, i.e. if you are going 60 mph, come to a full stop, and then accelerate back to 60 mph, 75% of the kinematic energy required to accelerate back to 60 mph is provided through regenerative braking (ignored friction, aerodynamic drag, etc.). The remaining 25% of the kinetic energy must come from plug-in energy stored in the HVB or from the ICE. Similarly, when the ICE charges the HVB, only 75% of that energy is actually used to propel the car. The rest is lost as heat by the generator/motor converting mechanical to electrical energy, the HVB storing the electrical energy, the HVB then recovering the stored energy and converting it to electrical energy, and finally the motor/generator then converting the electrical energy to mechanical energy. If you look at an accurate Engine Map for an ICE, you will see dramatic differences in the efficiency of the ICE at different operating points. It is entirely possible, by running the generating/motor to charge the HVB, the ICE is able to operate at a more efficient operating point and the overall ICE fuel usage is less with charging/discharging the HVB than simply only driving the wheels. The differences in efficiency at the various operating points is far greater than 25%. According to documents I have seen, the preferred mode of operation on the Highway at higher speeds is to not charge/discharge the HVB. But at lower speeds, it will start charging/discharging the HVB in addition to powering the wheels. I think the first mode, at highway speeds, is referred to as, negative split mode of operation. And the second mode, at lower speeds, is referred to as positive split mode of operation. Both modes attempt to force the ICE into a more efficient operating point. The outside temperature was about 50 F. I didn't use any significant energy from climate. If you are referring to balancing the mechanical power that was generated and consumed, you also need to account for friction. Not all of the mechanical energy can be transmitted to the wheels. In addition, the power at the wheels that I showed is not the measured power at the wheels, but the desired power at the wheels. All the other quantities were measured power.
  18. The generator/motor efficiency for regenerative braking also seems to be around 90%. So if we assume that the HVB efficiency is 97% for charging and for discharging, we get: Efficiency in capturing energy by HVB during regenerative braking: 90%*97% = 87%. Efficiency in recovering energy from HVB after regenerative braking: 90%*97% = 87%. So I estimate the overall efficiency of regenerative braking is about 87%*87% = 75%, i.e. you recapture about 75% of the kinetic energy lost by braking.
  19. The following plot is a Motor/Generator Map that shows the efficiency of the motor/generator for various RPMs and Torque. Generally, the efficiency is from 60% to 90%, i.e. if 1 kW of electric power is applied to the motor/generator, the motor/generator will produce between 0.65 and 0.90 kW of mechanical power. This map is a rough approximation of the true map. I am unable to get the measurements that are required for an accurate map and have to make several assumptions/approximations. The efficiency increases with increasing Torque and RPM. The blue markers show actual operating points of the motor/generator during my trips. The plot is only reasonably accurate in regions where there are markers. The remaining regions are computed by extrapolating the existing data and may not be correct. The power output required for the upper right portion of the map is beyond the capabilities of the motor/generator. The curved lines in the map show the mechanical power generated by the motor/generator. The lines range from 5 kW to 40 kW from left to right. A motor speed of 8400 rpm corresponds to about 60 mph. Note I can't isolate the generator from the motor, they both work together to power the vehicle. Going 30 mph, the efficiency is around 60%. Going 60 mph, the efficiency increases to 75%. You get significantly better efficiency during acceleration.
  20. The engine temperature display in the car shows the temperature of the coolant in the heater core loop, and not the temperature of coolant in the main loop. So if the electric heater is on, the car may show the engine temperature to be around 140 F. However, if the ICE has not actually run, the coolant temperature for the engine is really still only the outside temperature.
  21. Actually, the first mode of operation at 65 mph on the Freeway doesn't look too bad. The ICE is generating an extra 1.9 kW more power than required to drive the wheels. We need about 0.5 kW of additional power for the accessories. So that leaves the ICE generating about 1.4 kW more power than required. From that extra power, we are getting about 0.6 kW of electrical energy from the motor/generator to charge the HVB. In addition, it is probably forcing the ICE to operate at more efficient rpm/load operating point. The second mode of operation at 50 mph is probably not typical of what would be seen in hybrid mode driving at constant speed. I will have to collect more data to see what happens. The theory is that we can use the excess power generated by the ICE when we force it into a more efficient operating region to charge the HVB. And then when the HVB is full, we can turn off the ICE and use the electric motor to power the car. But in the example above, I think the ICE is being pushed far beyond its most efficient operating point. I believe the efficiency of the generator/motor runs around 75% to 90%. I will have to produce a Generator/Motor map that shows their efficiency.
  22. I observed the following power measurements this morning for my commute on the Freeway going about 65 mph in EV Later mode with the power flow screen showing Hybrid Drive: Mechanical Power Consumed Average power applied to wheels: 19.1 kW. Average power applied to motor: 7.4 kW Total: 26.5 kW Mechanical Power Generated Average power output from ICE: 21.0 kW Average power output from generator: 5.4 kW Total: 26.4 kW Electrical Power Consumed Average power consumed by accessories: 0.5 kW Average power applied to HVB: 0.6 kW Total: 1.1 kW I don't know how to measure the electrical power generated by the motor or consumed by the generator. The SOC of the battery increased slightly by about 0.69% during this 10 minute segment. The motor is generating electricity which is consumed by the HVB, generator, and accessories. The ICE is generating slightly more power than is required to drive the wheels. When in hybrid mode, after the HVB was depleted, I observed the following going about 50 mph with the power flow screen displaying Charging HV Battery: Mechanical Power Consumed Average power applied to wheels: 18.0 kW Average power applied to motor: 10.4 kW Average power applied to generator: 1.4 kW Total: 29.8 kW Mechanical Power Generated Average power output from ICE: 31.1 kW Electrical Power Consumed Average power consumed by accessories: 0.6 kW Average power applied to HVB: 10.5 kW Total: 11.1 kW This was for about a minute, so the measurements are not as accurate as above. The ICE is generating significantly more power than required to drive the wheels. So the question is, which is more efficient? "Hybrid Drive" (the first mode of operation above) which slightly increases the load on the ICE, or "Charging HV Battery" along with "Electric Drive" in hybrid mode (the second mode of operation above), charging and discharging the HVB battery, which places a significantly higher load on the ICE when charging the HVB and the ICE is completely off when discharging the HVB. Am I better off depleting the HVB as soon as possible, or saving it for later? The car does not seem to charge the HVB much during EV later mode--the power flow screen usually shows only Hybrid Drive. Note that Hybrid Drive is displayed when either the generator, the motor, or both are consuming electrical power. Charging HV Battery is displayed when both the generator and motor are generating electrical power.
  23. Looking at the car's estimated energy stored in the HVB vs. the amount of energy applied to the HVB by the charger inside the car, it looks like the HVB stores 97.3% of the energy applied to it. Discharging is also 97.3% efficient. The overall battery efficiency is 97.3%*97.3% = 94.7% efficient. This is close to the previous estimate of 94% efficiency. You get about 94-95% of the energy out of the battery that is put into it.
  24. If you leave a USB thumb drive in the USB port, watch the LED to indicate activity. I think that you will find that the light will flash at anytime, even when the car is turned off and has been off for a while.
  25. The following plot shows hybrid operation of the Fusion Energi, with the ICE on, driving on a freeway at 65 mph. Initially, the ICE is off. The ICE turns on around 3:36:43 pm. The purple line is the electrical power output from the HVB. When the power is positive, the HVB is discharging to provide power to run the motor/generator/accessories. When the power is negative, the HVB is charging from electrical power generated by the motor/generator. At the start, the electric motor and generator are consuming up to 28 kW of electrical power. Shortly after the ICE turns on, the electric motor and generator produce about 10 kW of power to charge the HVB. The blue line is the mechanical power output by the electric motor, which comes from the HVB. The red line is the mechanical power output by the generator, which also comes from the HVB. When the power is positive, the motor/generator is drawing power from the HVB to power the wheels. When the power is negative, they are providing power to the HVB. When the ICE turns on, the motor power and HVB power turn negative. The motor is charging the HVB. The generator power also becomes negative a little while later. Now both the generator and motor are charging the HVB. The Power Flow screen in the car now displays Charging HV Battery. Gradually, the generator power turns positive and hovers around 0. It is now drawing power from the HVB battery. The Power Flow screen now displays Hybrid Drive. The HVB is still being charged by the electric motor. The electrical power to charge the HVB remains about the same as before when the generator was also generating power to charge the HVB. Gradually, the generator consumes more and more electrical power to provide mechanical power to the wheels (the remaining power comes from the ICE). Near the end of the plot, the mechanical power output of the generator is about 6 kW. The electric motor is consuming about 8 kW of mechanical power to produce electricity. The total power to the HVB is around 0. The HVB is no longer being charged. The Power Flow screen still displays Hybrid Drive. I assume the goal here is to lug the ICE to force it into a more efficient operating region. The electric motor is increasing the load on the ICE by 8 kW and the generator is reducing the ICE's load by 6 kW, so the overall additional load on the ICE is 2 kW. Hopefully, the ICE now uses less fuel with the additional 2 kW load. I believe this is the negative-split mode of hybrid operation. The generator generates very little power. It comes mostly from the electric motor. Instead, it appears the generator is used to power the wheels along with the ICE.
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